Intrigue and Adventure VS CoA Sims
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i have to agree with moloch's first post here.. at the end of the day we are supposed to be playing adventurers or at least some semblance of them.
if i wanted to play The Sims i would have bought The Sims.
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The Sims is not multiplayer though :(
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Then buy a DS and play scratch my poodle or what ever the pet game is called
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@Wilin:
I think that the DMs foster a community of CoA Sims because players often feel powerless to do great adventures. There is one tool for great adventures outside of scripted quests: the application. I think that the DM base might want to figure out how to script more spontaneous adventures and have more curious things to do – or have more DMs to interact wtih the PCs.
Except you say all of this after I made it PATENTLY and almost ABSURDLY obvious what the DMs want you to do to and that we do give the players power to do great adventurers.
Applications are not the only way–being proactive and involving people using any of the ideas I proposed--and literally dozens of others you could think up yourself creatively all work.
IE: You're way off base and should really try a few of the things I'm suggesting. You'll find it works.
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The problem is many do not know what the DM's are going to respond to, myself included. In my case i try to keep my long term plans open to adaptation. For the changing situations and suprises the server keeps throwing out.
Do you suppose that's why I just spent an hour writing a post to clearly tell people what we want? :wink:
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Again, not a complaint, it's a function of when one chooses to play, but rather a pointing out that some people do what others might look at as "Sim like" because anything else is damn hard.
Again, this is why I am trying to explain HOW to not just follow hooks, but actually CREATE hooks that don't require a DM over your shoulder but that can create a stir in the player base without any DM involvement and could last days/weeks/ even months! until a DM-seeing how you've involved so many people in your idea–has time to get involved and do something awesome for you.
This is HOW you gain a DM's attention even if they aren't always in your time zone.
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The Sims is not multiplayer though :(
Enjoy the lovely weather, meet -real- people, develop -real- relationships, go to Thailand and get a real sex change so you can live out that lesbian dream…
I dont play nwn, and dnd to get laid, have relationship problems, fall in love, have sex in an inn room. I do all of those when I dont play.
I do play it to blow shit up, save the damsel in distress, be Senator Palpatine for a day, eat people as a werewolf, or crawl into dungeons filled with zombies and 20 feet long snakes.
Because those things, I cannot do without this game.I want to be an adventurer and a badass, I dont want to play a 40 year old man with grey hair whos wife just got pregant for the 15th time. I can imagine I will end up in that situation eventually, and I have no intention of getting ready for it.
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Moloch, this post is great, i'm so glad you made something like this. Examples! at last! thank you.
I think I had begun to work this out a bit recently anyway, but with this post it just helps remind people of a few ways to make the server intensely fun.
I just checked all my plans and goals against this post and it's intensely useful to do.
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For instance, we were planing to invite the new Gypsies along to the feast. What better way for the DM's to get the players to notice them? Or, lunch and Ashby attack.. or a Black Bloods assault.. or have the Half Orc tribe crash the party. I don't know. I want people to get interested in East Way as I think that it is going to be important to a few plots soon enough. Ashby, Clar Banda (old but still interesting), Half-Orc Tribe and the newly arrived Gypsies and so on. The more players interested in the town the better in the long run, right?
I think you missed my point. Try rereading the original post. The idea was not that "getting more players in one spot" is good. If we wanted that, we'd encourage people to stand in the market talking.
We want ADVENTURE and INTRIGUE.
We can not always, as games pointed out, provide it because we can't have 24/7 DM coverage. Instead, people should be organizing ADVENTURE and INTRIGUING against enemies in ways that lead to more ADVENTURE. The focus is not actually on getting 30 PCs in one area.
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@O'louth:
…have sex in an inn room. I do all of those when I dont play.
I thought we were keeping that quiet? That trip to see you didn't go as planned. [shudders]
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This
@Djanga:I think there needs to be a good mix between both.. and there is no reason the two cant mix.
and this
@Djanga:I mean this is a game that we play to enjoy in our own way is it not? I don't like going from scripted quest to scripted quest.. but some people do, and thats fine by me, if thats how they want to play the game. Just because you don't like something does not mean that other people -have- to feel the same way.
People are free to do what they want roleplay-wise.
I am not looking to dictate to anyone how to play or have fun. If you have fun- GREAT!
The point, again, is that if you want a DM to have fun–and to want to have fun with your character in a way that enhances your own fun--then the original post explains how to go about it. If you want to play a character that you enjoy who stays below the DM radar and isn't involved in plots, likely to get involved in DM factions, and isn't expecting any DM-granted perk--then its fine.
If you want any DM-love, then you need to realize what we enjoy seeing on the server.
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I find the sims usually as a hook to try and petition for DM attention, since people seem incredibly fixated on getting it. A lot of these things could simply be done on your own with other PCs, but most of the time it seems you find a lack of people interested in joining other's plots because they want to be the one 'in charge' and 'win' by getting said attention for their event.
Actually, my point was how to get a DM's attention. Its not enough to have a hook, you have to bait the hook with ADVENTURE and INTRIGUE.
Don't try to make a refugee camp on your own. It won't work. Follow my advise if you REALLY want to do something like that. NPCs do not respond to :
Forum Letters Saying You Want Something
Invitations To Dull EventsThey respond to ADVENTURE and INTRIGUE.
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@Love:
I thought CoA was a "political" server. Faction vs faction, PC's vs PC's. I'm surprised when Moloch says that it doesn't take much effort for a DM to set up an "adventure" for the players. I always thought you didn't have the time for that, or that you had to think of 5 small, smart events/plots of your own before you were "rewarded" with an "adventure". I've been focusing on PC vs PC when I've been setting my goals, trying to figure out the easiest and quickest way to start some conflict between two groups of people.
What I'm saying is this.
Suppose your Helmite has spent weeks or even months going on quests looking for the Lost Sword of Helmy McHelmite. He regularly takes other players on adventures to seek it out, organizes trips to the Underdark/Stormhorns/Vast Swamp looking for it (even though you know ooc that its not actually out there when you leave but you're roleplaying the search and quest for it).
It is really EASY for you to send a DM Tell saying "Heading into the Vast Swamp looking for the Sword of Helmy McHelmite which is a relic my PC is searching for that probably doesn't exist."
Now a DM seeing that and looking for something to do will go, GREAT! Then I'll spawn monsters, maybe spawn adventure and action for you, and maybe if I see you doing this long enough and I'm having lots of fun with your character-I'll spawn the Sword of Helmy McHelmite.
No application necessary. You were just doing awesome things getting people out to adventure and entertain them and me and so you gain my attention and a cool reward.
Now its feasible, you'll never find the Sword of Helmy McHelmite–but odds are you'll at the least get some attention. You may even earn the enmity of Mystran McMystie who wants the Sword of Helmy McHelmite to stay lost who will work against you as a player character to foil your searches and challenge you to duels and seek to undermine your followers.
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To be honest, there are times when I'd like a DM to put a request out for a party of people to do a one off adventure like this, that may or may not be related to ongoing quests. The DM then schedules the Event and people can book in. The DM vets the players/characters to see if they fit the profile for the quest or maybe reject someone who has done a lot of these recently in favour of someone who has not.
We've tried this. Often, interest is oddly low in it.
The other problem is, full time jobs, school, wives, kids, doctor appointments and so on make it very hard to schedule things in advance.
Which is another reason why we're trying to explain how to make interesting ADVENTURE and INTRIGUE that doesn't require a DM–but which also coincidentally earns you a DM's attention when he has time.
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It seems like this thread might be good for players who are interested in building and developing their own plot lines so I thought I'd chuck it in for those interested.
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Don't try to make a refugee camp on your own. It won't work. Follow my advise if you REALLY want to do something like that. NPCs do not respond to :
Forum Letters Saying You Want Something
Invitations To Dull EventsThey respond to ADVENTURE and INTRIGUE.
I was referring more to the part where there seems to be this 'feel' like people want to do these things on their -own- with DM assistance, instead of trying to get the ball rolling with -other- PCs.
Because, I guess, sharing the attention isn't something that people want to do? It stops being -their- success, which people seem to crave, and a group success. I'd like to see more group successes where someone isn't trying to be 'in charge' with their minions aiding them, from both 'Teams'.
If it is things you can do for yourself in game, why not do them yourself? If you don't -need- DM involvement if you can bring in other PCs instead of hunt or donate or fund or god knows what, why not do that? In turn these other PCs, while taking the limelight off of yourself, may often bring things to the table that can step up a plan to make an otherwise boring 'refugee' camp into anything from a front for slavers to eventually a new church of Ilmater or another benevolent god.
I find RP on this server to often serve well at a moderate range. Not alone, not you and a single partner even, but in small focused groups of PCs, 3-6, where you can get a diverse pool of ideas and directions that will spice up even a bland run in the scripted Tymoran crypts, let alone a major event being planned for sometime in the future.
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To be honest, there are times when I'd like a DM to put a request out for a party of people to do a one off adventure like this, that may or may not be related to ongoing quests. The DM then schedules the Event and people can book in. The DM vets the players/characters to see if they fit the profile for the quest or maybe reject someone who has done a lot of these recently in favour of someone who has not.
We've tried this. Often, interest is oddly low in it.
The other problem is, full time jobs, school, wives, kids, doctor appointments and so on make it very hard to schedule things in advance.
Which is another reason why we're trying to explain how to make interesting ADVENTURE and INTRIGUE that doesn't require a DM–but which also coincidentally earns you a DM's attention when he has time.
Neanderthal has done this at least once. I got to tag along on a cool little "treasure hunt" that was a one off. They are indeed fun and challenging, but agreeably, they are difficult to throw together.
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For instance, we were planing to invite the new Gypsies along to the feast.
Not having any clue what this feast or cookout is….
Why not expressly make up invitations that say "No halflings welcome"
Or
"All performances will be handed by Rhapsody. Please no other singing."
or
something else to make people show up ticked off, instead of happy.That has a chance at making intrigue and conflict, as opposed to just emoting wiping tuna salad off each other's cheek while at a picnic.
(Please don't take it as belittling your event, which I have no clue what it is, I just couldn't resist the picnic comment for something called a cookout)
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I have no clue if some of the things mentioned are randomly off the top of your head or you were purposely trying to allude to some current events.
Regarding a certain "cookout". The whole druid VS hunter scenario is being played out and many people are being involved.
In general though, there's a point being missed. People don't want to spend their game time planning cook outs all the time, building shelters, running charities etc etc (believe me its tedious)…But it really goes well when trying to make a name for yourself. That's what characters are out there for no?
You're asking, why aren't they doing stuff that's more adventure oriented? Because I think there is miss-communication between DMs and players.
Why am I holding a cookout? So DMs will notice and plan to run a special expedition for me to slay the most fantastical beast and bring its meat to a wealthy lord.
Why am I planning to build a shelter? So that a DM will notice me, and maybe on behalf of a powerful lord commend me so that I will be recognized, and my opinions will be held in high regard (when actual PvP comes into question), or on behalf of a secret goodly society contact me.
I honestly can't imagine seeing you running something if I sent any DMs a PM like this:
"Hey, I have 8 people that want to go to storm Zhentil keep. They're high lvl so we'll be pretty good for fighting loads of hardcore Zhents. Anyways, it'd be cool if you put some awsome loot there for us when we come.
Cheers!"
Obviously an exaggeration, but even if I dumped a whole lot of really well thought storyline into it...Would you consider throwing something this big for the sole purpose of me and 8 others getting awsome loot and awsome xp?
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You clearly missed the entire point. Please try reading the original post again. See if you can't get the part where I said that "holding a cook-out" is not really a good way to make a name for yourself. Yet, where I did say, taking people out to hunt some rare fantastic beast to cook (even if you don't expect to find it) is a good way to make a name for yourself.