Coa is not pw story/rp anymore. Its pw action/story lite.
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I disagree with the thingy about characters being past their prime once they kill a dragon or whatever. In fact, I think one of the things the server is missing is legendary PCs, characters who have a strong history of being a hero or a villain. This may seem odd to people who have played with me over the years, as I tend to drop characters on a dime, but thats just my own personal ADD and not a preference on what I like seeing. Yes, a guy who kills a dragon then wanders the roads killing goblins because he has nothing better to do sounds blah, but a character who starts something due to his legendary status (new faction, school for adventurers, whatever) seems like it would be a solid contribution to the server.
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Have to say Arabel is now alot like EFU used to be and to be honest while efu was alright it let you affect the server as a player and run things etc..
It didn't go far enough the dm's were still in charge running things as they wanted things to go..much like it feels on arabel these days.For example a DM plot is a story that a dm writes then runs for players to take part in.Now the players may want it to turn out one way or another and the dm may let them change a few things along the way but the story isn't the players story it's the dm's.
Efu did this and now so does CoA.swings his lantern and offers a sandbag for a seat
An example of the difference between how things were and how things are.
Before.."when i first came to CoA i had no idea what it was about or like i made an elf(lots do)logged on was walking from the east gate up behind what is now the adventurers guild and was acosted by a mugger(pc thug)
He made a few threats and my silly little elven girl screamed in fear and that brought pc guards and adventurers running leading to me getting hooked on the server due to the amount of player interacton to be had."Now.."make a new character and log on …..if you do in fact manage to get somone to stop for longer than the time it takes to type nodsto the new character it's rare while the rp is good when they do stop it's not common place."
Before...
You could find like minded peaple even with limited game time and with ease due to the lines being clear cut.Now..
Blurring of good evil law and chaos has made the server more dynamic and changable yes..but now it's alot harder to find a group that shares the same intrests as your character does..im not talking about long standing players that know the server like the backs of there hands and know oocly what each faction is up to or and the types of peaple in them,but new players. -
@Amy:
For example a DM plot is a story that a dm writes then runs for players to take part in.Now the players may want it to turn out one way or another and the dm may let them change a few things along the way but the story isn't the players story it's the dm's.
I do believe it is the exact opposite right now. I never played during the WW and PD era, but it seems right now DMs are much more approachable and the server is affectable by everyone. You say plots are stories written by DMs, but I have personally experienced that if you have a good story in mind, and are able to involve other players, chances are a DM will show interest and help you tell it. All those talking about going out and looking for artifacts, or about creating intrigue is true. DMs are looking to tell a story as much as you, and it will be neither yours or theirs story, it will be everyone's.
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I do believe it is the exact opposite right now. I never played during the WW and PD era
If you never played then it would be hard to compare now with then,and no it isn't opposite some seem to think it is but they are wrong players could still get little dm events run for them if they were involving other players and adding fun to the server.you may get more of that now but it was still there.
it seems right now DMs are much more approachable
No Dm's were approchable then in fact some of the current dm's were dm's back then to it's just peaple have gotten some idea that dm's were b$%&£$ds back then or somthing(well maybe one or two).
You say plots are stories written by DMs, but I have personally experienced that if you have a good story in mind, and are able to involve other players, chances are a DM will show interest and help you tell it.
Yes if you have a good player driven plot going then dm's tend to help out…as they did back then,not as much as now but they did.Dm created plots written by the dm not a player involving others in there own thing,are still the Dm's stories not the players taking part the players are the pieces of the game not the game itself.
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@Leaders:
I disagree with the thingy about characters being past their prime once they kill a dragon or whatever. In fact, I think one of the things the server is missing is legendary PCs, characters who have a strong history of being a hero or a villain. This may seem odd to people who have played with me over the years, as I tend to drop characters on a dime, but thats just my own personal ADD and not a preference on what I like seeing. Yes, a guy who kills a dragon then wanders the roads killing goblins because he has nothing better to do sounds blah, but a character who starts something due to his legendary status (new faction, school for adventurers, whatever) seems like it would be a solid contribution to the server.
Someone who DID that wouldn't be quite as 'blah' as you put it. The thing is, rarely do the guys who have hit the top gracefully fade into the background, leaving room for someone else to become a legend from their new faction or school of adventurers. Typically, they continue to be the first one looking to slay the next dragon because they're still the most powerful guy around.
Its still the metaphor of a tree falling in a forest, when the mightiest oak topples, it makes room for the next aspiring tree to grow into the tallest.
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@Leaders:
I disagree with the thingy about characters being past their prime once they kill a dragon or whatever. In fact, I think one of the things the server is missing is legendary PCs, characters who have a strong history of being a hero or a villain. This may seem odd to people who have played with me over the years, as I tend to drop characters on a dime, but thats just my own personal ADD and not a preference on what I like seeing. Yes, a guy who kills a dragon then wanders the roads killing goblins because he has nothing better to do sounds blah, but a character who starts something due to his legendary status (new faction, school for adventurers, whatever) seems like it would be a solid contribution to the server.
Someone who DID that wouldn't be quite as 'blah' as you put it. The thing is, rarely do the guys who have hit the top gracefully fade into the background, leaving room for someone else to become a legend from their new faction or school of adventurers. Typically, they continue to be the first one looking to slay the next dragon because they're still the most powerful guy around.
Its still the metaphor of a tree falling in a forest, when the mightiest oak topples, it makes room for the next aspiring tree to grow into the tallest.
Ergh, I feel somewhat dirty for doing this but…I totally agree with Moloch on this one.
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This is a fun debate. I'll add my two cents.
There seems to be a "Then and now", arguement going here. "In the good ole days we did it this way and now…." To a degree I can agree with this. A couple of years ago there wasn't the plot frenzy running at this fevered pitch that we have now. Characters had a bit more interaction and the story wasn't about the server plots, but the characters personal story. At least that was my perception. It doesn't make sense to heap coals upon the heads of the Dm's for the changes though. Not entirely anyway. They have certainly provided the fuel for the "plot frenzy", but they didn't light the match. The lack of interaction between characters and the hustle from plot point to plot point with disregard for deeper character interaction is a trend in playing behavior that comes from us. I mean... we can ignore the dm plots to a degree if we want to right? A few players have figured out the formula for knocking out these plots and they are laser focused on it. I think that's what people percieve when they see a character hustle by with little or no interaction. That player has to see you as a device in the plot frenzy formula in order to find you of use. This makes the server come off as a bit cold.
I myself have tried to follow the string of plots an honestly... more often than not I've been disapointed with the outcome. After putting energy and time into a plot I of course then have some expectation of seeing it through to completion. Rarely on Arabel does this happen for me. I'm not blaming anyone in particular, I just don't have the time or temperment to follow the formula, and I rarely contact dms directly because they usually seem like they've got better things to do.
Arabel is a fun place to play. I think if we treat it more like a game and less like an objective to be overcome, the more fun it will be.
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seconding Euphemystic. Players have things in their own hands.
I think there's differences between TZs, too, but in the end if you don't liek the way things are going, you can try to change them by positive action, go along with/ignore the way things work, or leave if you really don't like the way things are going.P.
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You know what I don't like? This coincides with Euphemystic's point. I don't like how I must feel obligated to go to this or that in order for something substantial to happen. Everything, or everything inportant and effective at least, has been boiled down to dates almost. DM events, this or that player event, we're all too focused on the time.
I can agree on some extent that this is an easier way to go about it, but then as a player you feel beholden to play on a certain day, at a certain time, or you miss out on some of the fun. Notice I say some, not all. There's still the occassional improvisation on the DMs part. They've done a good job of implementing a lot of things straight into the server though, so player events can go by quicker and smoother on a shorter-term basis without needing their help. But honestly, is it enough? Can it be enough? Nothing's perfect.
A fix to this? I'm not so sure there is one necessarily, at least not one that I can personally come up with miraculously. I will say that the DMs are doing a great job though. I just wish that some things could be focused on a more personal basis. Life isn't always about "What's changing the big picture?" as I'm seeing this server doing now. And even through personal events can substantial things happen. For example of the big picture idea, these things where a Shout is made that this or that is happening, then the whole server shows up, any player can go. While that's all well and fine, it completely lacks the personal aspect. It's about what this or that Faction did, and if you're not in a Faction, you're pretty much S.O.L.
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I don't think the limb will break when I crawl out on it and say that so much is wrong with that last post that it's impossible to know where to begin.
I log on and see who's out wandering around or doing something. If I find someone, I run something impromptu for them, regardless of alignment, faction, background, or whatever. I'm not at all the only DM who does this. I'll sometimes schedule things, but 9/10 times it just depends on what's going on in-game and who's actually doing something.
You will also always miss out on some of the fun. It's a 24 hour server and you can be sure that somebody, somewhere is having fun for the majority of those 1,440 minutes– possibly with a DM.
When I was a player, I was part of maybe 5 DM events. I still had loads of fun without them.
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when i log into the game now i specifically check the player list for names i have not interacted with before in game
i make note of the ones who are 2nd level and lower, and i try to see if i can run into them in game and then try to make friends and show them around.
if my time is limited i do send the person a tell and ask them if they would like to be shown around arabel.occasionally i still find new players, but a lot of the time i find established players, but i still try to help them as a character since it is a important character trait with my character, one that has served me quite well.
most of the time when i am in game i am busy, i am either rping with characters that are important to me and my character, or getting to know new ones who may eventually fall into this category….
...or i am spreading rumors..one person at a time
the server is still fun for me, but it should be a fun and welcoming place to new players, grievers i realize have to be handled differently than a new player who may be simply frustrated by trying to learn a new server and the locations where people meet, sometimes i find it tough to find other character in game and many times my playing session is cut short by not being able to find others to interact with, i am sure it is no different for new players
i know it is not our place to attend to every new player who stops by, but it would be nice if we spent extra time when we do find someone new or returning who needs a bit of help, i have been guilty of not helping new ones as much as i should, i found when i was in factions that this was quite difficult when others above you are telling you what to do, but in a faction it is a enviable position you have in being able to include new ones, which i wish i had done more of, hind sight is twenty twenty and there are so many things i now wish i had done
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Not in an argumentative sense, but why is my personal experiences as a player wrong necessarily, Harry? I know I'm not the only person that feels like this, I can't be. Unless I'm just a dumbass. :P Oh well then.
Rage of Impulse: I can agree on some extent that this is an easier way to go about it, but then as a player you feel beholden to play on a certain day, at a certain time, or you miss out on some of the fun. Notice I say some, not all.
Harry: I'll sometimes schedule things, but 9/10 times it just depends on what's going on in-game and who's actually doing something.
Yes, of course, this is good. I know this happens, also. I never denied that fact.
Rage of Impulse: I don't like how I must feel obligated to go to this or that in order for something substantial to happen. Everything, or everything important and effective at least, has been boiled down to dates almost.
This is what I meant. There've been many times of course where a DM, you (Harry) even did it once, where Redfang was out and about and something cool happens; one time a DM grabbed hold of an ogre and did some role play before we slaughtered it. I love this. I mean, am I wrong though, in the quote? Maybe. If I am, the opposite hasn't happened to me yet, in which one of those improvised encounters actually turns out to be something big.
I'm very content with how the server is right now, despite what I've said. I have a great time playing. So don't get me wrong.
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I'd say over half the time I spend logged in game, I'm just hunting down player who are out and doing things and providing them something to do beyond just kill the random spawns. Granted, I look for groups, not individuals out doing things.
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Love the server.
Only wish that it was easier to communicate exactly what you plan to get done, and preferably get feedback on how to go about it.
IRC, PM's, it all works, yes, but still, I find it hard to progress my own plots a fair bit.
But, that's probably just me.
I try and make most of what I do do-able without DM's, but there comes a point where your gonna need one to change something perhaps, and, if they haven't seen what you've been doing, because you have done it without DM's, well, they might not be able to make a call as to whether you've achieved what is needed for that change to occur. There's also the very real chance that what you have been doing, isn't actually going to get what you want done, done.
It must be insane trying to keep up with PM's coming in from so many players, never mind give feedback though, so, dunno.
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The insanity is high, but we do try.
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Yeah, I can only imagine. You guys as the DMs really do what you do well, there's no denying that. Knowing that fact, you can even say that the problems I brought up in my earlier discussion can only thusly be solved by the players themselves. Like me, namely. For example I brought up that I'd like events to be more personal; there's really nothing the DMs can necessarily do that would properly sate that want for every player, every character.
It takes the player's dedication to create a dynamic environment that doesn't just consist of Big Plot A moving to Big Plot B, but rather also includes Sub Plots A through Z and even then, more niche things in between. Circling this around to the very title of the thread, CoA either being a Sims or strictly a server of A/I really depends on the players. If someone wants to role play for an hour, say, a gardening scene, he/she should really feel free. Just don't be surprised when you're doing it alone and a DM doesn't take the time to help. On the other hand, if all you're worried about is Adventure, Intrigue, and the big picture relating to plots, then you also miss out on the fun of playing a real character with thoughts and feelings. You have to find a middle ground.
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Anytime I hear CoA being accused of being an action server, I laugh a little, just because the XP penalties on respawn prevent that.
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It's just real Hardcore, dude.
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Only thing thats different is the server is never even close to 55/55 anymore. (Or at least when im on) In fact I've never seen more than 30 on at one time recently. Therefore, Less people = Less people to RP with.
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As I live on an island in the middle of nowhere everyone knows eachother. Well, not so personally but there is allways someone you know there at all times so to say. It's a bit the same on CoA. So I work just fine with it.
Still If you've worked on a great concept and it involves 30 people ( in conflicts or whatever) I'd see it a good success.