Legal Peacekeeping rights in the Historic District
-
I'd like to discuss having the Precept being able to officially name peace keepers for the Historic District.
We currently have Bloodhounds there, doing the job as they can- however, as was preven not so long ago, legally their peacekeeping powers are not actually enforceable in the same way as say, the Militia.
You can defy the bloodhounds, and currently, the council can simply ignore it, and no legal charges can be brought to the transgressor.
This is pretty chaotic.
It would be much safer if there were legal repurcussions for diobeying the reasonable orders of those named by the Precept as peacekeepers in the district.
Let's have the other councillors thoughts, and I will put up a vote.
-Izereth
-
Here is an example of why this is neeccassary.
@latoksinned said in Letter to the Precept, with a CC to Jim and Pelagia:
Precept,
Please do not take this as a personal attack, as I do rather like some of your members and I am a firm believer people should be judged by their actions and not by their blood, so It bothers me when anyone is persecuted. Long story short, it is those beliefs that got me fired from my last job.
I digress. According to the Lawbook of Arabel, Article IV: The Free People's Militia is the official militia of Arabel. Additionally, Armed assault and impersonating authority are crimes punishable by not less than 5000 gold coins. Although you have the power of force to beat people in the historical district, it would be contrary to the law and overall public safety.
It is my duty, as a hopeful future guard, to inform you any attack on someone you have claimed are banished from the historical district would be extra-judicial, despite whether they might deserve it or not and thus I'll be forced to inform you that any attack on a strange splash priest would result in a 10000 gold fine per individual engaging in said attack, and those assaulted would be well in their right to defend themselves, lethally if necessary.
If you have any legal issues with said priest, please let me know and I'll do my best to ensure it's taken care of. I understand the guard here don't like dealing with... well... really anything around here so I'm happy to help. Now, I can't take any fines from anyone nor actually punish anyone, so don't take this as a threat, more of a warning if anyone would actually care to enforce said law.
Cheers and stay safe,
Kazimir -
How would the Bloodhounds perform their duty as theoretical law enforcers? And, how would this affect non-bloodhounds of the Precept? I do not deem the idea impossible, however a mere presence in the district is not enough. The district has always had a independent flare to it, due to the strong influence of Tymora's Temple. I look forward to the other Councilor's ideas and opinions on the matter, and perhaps it would be wise to pull a man who wishes to enforce law into our fold as well.
Dame Drakebane
-
Whilst I support this in theory what happens if the Greywatch get enough favour to replace the Bloodhounds in the Historic?
Do they suddenly decide who are peacekeepers?
Sir Pierre
-
What I am asking for, and what seems to be expected here, may be two different things.
I merely ask for the Precept to be officially able to place people into the district, who it would be a criminal act to disobey the reasonable requests of. (This would include all members of the Arcanum)
A recent situation with a Knight of the Morning showed that this was not the case with the current situation. Two bloodhounds died after asking the knight to leave. the knight was not prosecuted.
I wish to make it so that people could, and would be prosecuted under similar circumstances.
I do not wish to make the Bloodhounds into the militia. Just make it so that people know that it is indeed illegal to defy reasonable requests of those watching over the peace there.The simplest way is to grant rights that exist in the lawbook already.
Sir Pierre, this is not about the Greywatch.
-Izereth
-
I may be missing something, aren't there Bloodhounds posted in the Historic district already? Are you asking for permission to place more Bloodhounds in the district? Are you wanting the Precept to be sole guard of the Historic? I thought Greywatch and Precepts both guarded it. Or am I mistaken?
-Jenny
-
I was under the understanding that the Precepts was a main authority in magical issues. Also, you state that you want rights that are granted in the lawbooks already, which law are you specifically addressing? If such a law is already granted, then why are we talking about this?
-Jenny
-
They are posted, but have no legal authority, because the council decided a knight that killed two of them didn't even have to apologise.
See this:
https://nodebb.cityofarabel.com/topic/56894/vote-stillwater-apologizing-to-the-precept
I'm asking we officialy recognise the Precept in order that the people they name as peacekeepers there must have reasonable requests obeyed, or you are breaking the law.
-Izereth
-
I'm not talking about the incident that happened, I'm trying to understand your goal in wanting control of the Historic district. As far as I'm concerned, if you want to ban people from the Historic, you are free to enforce that ban.
-Jenny
-
I dont see any harm in it
It should prevent zealous cultists and Lathanderites and other criminal scum like the Lower House doing as they please
Sir Pierre
-
I don't care about "control" of the district Jenny, I want the council to agree to charges being brought on people, so that they don't believe they can just get away with murder.
The incident is an example to illustrate the problem that currently exists.
Currently, if I was a dangerous person, and the bloodhounds posted asked me to leave, I could just lightning bolt them, and carry on. No legal repurcussions.
Does that sound like a good idea? If not, should we change that so that I would be charged with evasion of a peace official, and armed assault?
-Izereth
-
Excellent questions have been raised, yet none answered in a satisfactory way. I hope further information will be brought to the discussion, as little sway has happened.
Dame Drakebane
-
I do think it's a good idea Izereth
I just want to know what you think should happen if the Precept can't send bloodhounds to guard the historic district due to lack of resources.
So far I've seen the Greywatch occasionally have guards there and once Luckbringers from the Tymoran church.
Should whoever has guards there decide who is peacekeepers there?
Sir Pierre
-
Alright then, I have picked out all of the questions asked, and I will answer them.
@puffy said in Legal Peacekeeping rights in the Historic District:
How would the Bloodhounds perform their duty as theoretical law enforcers?
They already do. There is just no legal recompense for defying them, so if you can kick their ass, you're free to go. We don't put our most powerful people on those streets, as is the same with every faction, the most powerful are out doing the most important things.
@v-rage said in Legal Peacekeeping rights in the Historic District:
what happens if the Greywatch get enough favour to replace the Bloodhounds in the Historic?
Then it would work just as it doeas now with the Greywatch. If they wish to bring their own vote to the council to change this, they are welcome to do so. However, they don't really follow the law as written, but their own personal form of justice, so I find it unlikely.
@v-rage said in Legal Peacekeeping rights in the Historic District:
Do they suddenly decide who are peacekeepers?
No. See above.
@prettysmitten said in Legal Peacekeeping rights in the Historic District:
aren't there Bloodhounds posted in the Historic district already?
Yes there are.
@prettysmitten said in Legal Peacekeeping rights in the Historic District:
Are you asking for permission to place more Bloodhounds in the district?
No.
@prettysmitten said in Legal Peacekeeping rights in the Historic District:
Are you wanting the Precept to be sole guard of the Historic?
No.
@prettysmitten said in Legal Peacekeeping rights in the Historic District:
I thought Greywatch and Precepts both guarded it. Or am I mistaken?
You are mistaken. The Precept and the Greywatch vie for position to have men watching the streets, for our own reasons, one of those reasons for the Precept, can be understood by reading the oath we take, in which it states "I promise to keep the laws"
@prettysmitten said in Legal Peacekeeping rights in the Historic District:
you state that you want rights that are granted in the lawbooks already, which law are you specifically addressing?
I want the council to agree that, should someone defy the peacekeepers put in place by the Precept Arcanum, they would be committing:
-Evasion of a Peace Official- Intentional deception, evasion, or misdirection aimed at a member of the Council or Militia.
Should they attack them they would be committing:
-Armed Assault- Using any means to inflict excessive physical or magical violence on an unwilling individual. An individual killed and returned by magical means or miracle is to be treated as Armed Assault, unless the individual is a brave hero of the revolution or officiate in service of the Councils.
Should they kill them in this attack they would be comitting:
-Murder- Causing, directly or through carelessness, the death of any Arabellan citizen or foreign diplomat.
@prettysmitten said in Legal Peacekeeping rights in the Historic District:
If such a law is already granted, then why are we talking about this?
Clearly, it isn't, otherwise the Knight of the Morning would have had charges brought against them when they diobeyed a reasonable request, attacked, and then murdered two bloodhounds in the district.
@v-rage said in Legal Peacekeeping rights in the Historic District:
I just want to know what you think should happen if the Precept can't send bloodhounds to guard the historic district due to lack of resources.
So far I've seen the Greywatch occasionally have guards there and once Luckbringers from the Tymoran church.
Should whoever has guards there decide who is peacekeepers there?As stated above, if other organisations wish to petition the council for a similar stipulation, they are free to do so. I am petitioning this on behalf of the Precept Arcanum.
This should answer all questions asked thus far. If they are any other specific questions you wish answered, let's have them. We are about to be attacked by a preist who is fully aware of what happened when a knight of the morning did the same.
-Izereth
-
Moved from Plot Faction: Council of Twelve Peers by
Puffy
