Kill On Sight: Is it realy?
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I'd rather be banned than not speak my mind on a topic like this-
You've got to be kidding me!
The entire point of playing a monster is the challenge and the struggle and the hardship.
If you as players and as DMs do not attack on sight even if it makes sense for your PC or NPC to do so you are depriving the player of the monster of a huge amount of what makes playing a monster fun: the sheer struggle for survival.
It would infuriate me to a level you can not even imagine if I could apply for a kobold and walk around Arabel without players trying to kill me on sight, no questions asked. What's the point?
My god: the entire point of being a monster is painting a huge target on your back because you love the rush of adrenaline and because you love being something different and wild. If you don't cater to this by being suitably hateful, realistic characters and all spontaneously decide to form the People for Ethical Treatment of Monsters group then good riddance; you don't deserve cool, well-played monsters.
OP sounds like he just lost his first monstrous PC. Ah, I remember my first. I was mad for days.
This, This, This.
It drove me insane when I could see a full on half-demon, a FEY-RI, walk unmolested in Arabel. This simply should not have happened. She should of been told to leave or get mobbed and killed. That was a level of tolerance that was not only silly, it was obscenely stupid. You're in a lawful good city, and you're permitting an entity that Actively Spreads Evil due to it's VERY nature, an irredeemable creature that cannot possibly be good… and you're not trying to kill it? Even Half-Celestials would come under immense scrutiny, they aren't human. They cannot possibly sympathize with the human condition, they are just so DIFFERENT. The concept of 'alien' comes into mind…their world view and perspective is simply far to different for them to approach a problem the same way a human could fathom. This is why even a lawful good cleric of Tyr might be opposed to their presence.
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@SpiffyHas:
It drove me insane when I could see a full on half-demon, a FEY-RI, walk unmolested in Arabel. This simply should not have happened. ….
App-race char equates to people thinking it might get some DM attention on it, equates to everyone being buddy buddy with it in hopes of more DM action. Simple as that.
As I mentioned with the Ogre example, while I dont think such would be "kill on sight" if it walked up to the gates…. it probably would be if found un-escorted in the city
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It drove me insane when I could see a full on half-demon, a FEY-RI, walk unmolested in Arabel. This simply should not have happened. ….
while many will realise that they are inherently evil, not all will initially, that aside though when they are willing to walk in full view you ooc know that they must be of significant power to do so openly and then you have to ask the question…
'does my lowbie with no magic weapon stand a chance calling out that level ? half dragon/feyri/lycan monk?'
and the follow up if the answer for you is yes is then 'is there a DM about that will supervise at this short notice?'
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I can't agree more with the whole "We don't take monstrous characters seriously enough" thing. When a half black dragon can quest with LG characters or when a tiefling can walk through the city, tail wagging, without any batting an eyelash… we have problems. In real world society people are ostracized just for little thinks like a mole on their face or wearing glasses and yet for some reason people flock to these monsters creatures like a ferret to something shiny. Its unrealistic at best, utterly stupid at worst. Every time my lycan interacted with the noble houses, they watched me with their hands on their weapons and threats of turning me into a rug. THAT IS THE WAY IT IS SUPPOSED TO BE! Sure my /character/ felt like he was being treated unfairly but I knew that this was the reaction that is intended when you have a monster character. When Akdul was famous, he had every paladin or goodly being trying to hunt him down. An uncontested goal is a boring goal, just like an uncontested monster is one that slowly slips into the backdrop and never becomes famous or achieves their goals. I don't always agree with Moloch but when he suggested I retire my lycan he was right, everyone accepted him, nobody cared that he was a lycan anymore and it became impossible to do anything without going full out evil and trying to kill everyone just to garner a reaction. The original poster was right about people distrusting a lone monster and maybe not killing it if it isn't a threat, however, EVERYONE would treat it like a monster and want nothing to do with it unless it did something amazing to prove itself aside from just having a different appearance.
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I was once yelled at, OOCLY BY DMS AND PLAYERS, for killing a wererat pc who tried, on first encounter, to assassinate my wanted pc. That was silly. But when I logged in yesterday, found TWO retainers of house Hardcastle, questing freely, and openly defending a thayan TIEFLING WITH A TAIL! That is where I draw the line.
I am not trying to take matters of IC ooc. But WTF? The same goes for Hinty's Hunter Tiefling. Beloved by everyone IC. I dig the character OOC, but seriously guys… My aasimar received more distrust than anyone shows tieflings.
Same happened with CB's tiefling. It needs to stop. People apply to play monsters. Id say bring in the same approach as EFU on the matter. If you play a monster race, it should be allowed for ANYONE to kill you. Perhaps that will draw some lines, and get the whole fear of evil back on track?
Tieflings are monsters. They arent misunderstood X men with dm attention.
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…Every time my lycan interacted with the noble houses...
the most visible lycan of recent times was a retainer, which kind of sets a precedent.
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I don't think options are limited to: 1. FD subrace PCs on sight. 2. Coddle subrace PCs. There's lots of room for creative RP in between those two.
You can shame, disgrace, rob, humiliate, torture, threaten, even just "accidentally" let them escape, etc, a PC before a final FD encounter, which IMO makes things more interesting. It just requires a little creative thinking. Conflicts should never be sustained indefinitely, but it's really not that hard to drag them out for a week or two for story's sake.
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I don't think options are limited to: 1. FD subrace PCs on sight. 2. Coddle subrace PCs. There's lots of room for creative RP in between those two.
You can shame, disgrace, rob, humiliate, torture, threaten, even just "accidentally" let them escape, etc, a PC before a final FD encounter, which IMO makes things more interesting. It just requires a little creative thinking. Conflicts should never be sustained indefinitely, but it's really not that hard to drag them out for a week or two for story's sake.
This +73398392! If you are a monstrous pc, people should at the very least distrust you. I don't think it should be kill on sight, however, you shouldn't have so many pc's flocking to them like flies to honey. What needs to be happening is at the very least anyone with "Good" in their alignment needs to be not so quick to even quest with a monstrous race, especially if you were just out mindlessly slaughtering nPC's of that race in the last quest. As a minimum (with NPC subdue available now) PC's who protest against discrimination of PC substances need to be shy from bloodshed in quests. Unrealistic IMOP
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I would never kill another character just for the sake of what they apped for. That doesnt make the plot wheel go round. And drow, tieflings, half dragons, whatever, would never get to more than lvl 1. That said, my argument is that they shouldnt be protected by the same strict OOC rules as "normal" pcs should.
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@O'louth:
Tieflings are monsters. They arent misunderstood X men with dm attention.
Sorry, what? Tieflings are tieflings. I'm unsure where "misunderstood x men with dm attention" even come from. Those of us playing tieflings understand full well the racial matter. But who are you to say that we haven't overcome some of those issues, by logging in, what - one time and going OMG THEY'RE CODDLING THE EVOL (Meta game much?) TIEFLING.
Jeez Olouth.
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With the tiefling history of evil and mayhem on this server, tieflings should be KoS, but they're not. Needs more hate to the evil/monstrous subraces
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@O'louth:
Tieflings are monsters. They arent misunderstood X men with dm attention.
Sorry, what? Tieflings are tieflings. I'm unsure where "misunderstood x men with dm attention" even come from. Those of us playing tieflings understand full well the racial matter. But who are you to say that we haven't overcome some of those issues, by logging in, what - one time and going OMG THEY'RE CODDLING THE EVOL (Meta game much?) TIEFLING.
Jeez Olouth.
A Tiefling has the blood of fiend running through them. This means that they are inherently demonic or devilish by blood. It isn't metagaming to see one and assume evil. Also, given the current state of the server (An entire town recently demolished by a demonic horde) it wouldn't make much sense for everyone to be "OH.. with all these rumors of demons less than a day's walk from our walls… we should definitely trust this person with demon blood... there is no way this could go bad". Granted, case by case basis not all tiefling characters have the same motives, but Olouth is correct in that there isn't enough realistic character interaction when it comes to dealing with /any/ monster race.
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Honestly, I'm tired of hearing about it. People are welcome to make PC's who go OMG A MONSTER. And fight them. Adds conflict to the server.
Do it and quit whining on the forums about it.
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With the tiefling history of evil and mayhem on this server, tieflings should be KoS, but they're not. Needs more hate to the evil/monstrous subraces
Such attitudes severely limit quest train potential you know. sarcasm
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With the tiefling history of evil and mayhem on this server, tieflings should be KoS, but they're not. Needs more hate to the evil/monstrous subraces
This.
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As was mentioned in the neighbouring thread conflict with popular characters (e.g. DM faction character) can very well leave you stranded quest- and rp-wise. You call tiefling a freak in the Guildhall, everyone says you're an ass and leave to do something cool. Without you.
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Its like the people here are playing two different games…
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I agree with much with Direfish' post above. It echos my experience with the game as of late.
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Knightmare's answer should've ended this thread, by the way.
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"Monster" PCs shouldn't be in factions
It always made me sad when PCs with tails or wings were swanning about in public factions - why on earth would a LG city allow a Tiefling Thayan Knight with a tail to march around the city, no questions asked, and why are players walking around doing it?
That aside it's all down to the PC when it comes to players - everyone who comes up with a character (should) have a personality and background sorted, so rock out like a hurricane.
From the DMs side there should be more of a reaction from NPCs with regards monster PCs (tieflings, aasimars, half dragons) and probably more of a strict leash put on where they can go and what they can do. The same goes with half orcs too, CoA needs more racism!