PVP OOC Courtesy.

  • If you're openly willing to bring a full gank party to assault people with the intention full damage killing people and then lose it's really depressing to have you just say "//Kill me now you might as well." Especially if you're the one who initiates it! None of us wanted to FD kill anyone and had ZERO intention of FD'ing anyone

    –Edited due to personal attacks against specific players which is unacceptable--Moloch

  • And then to top it all off you trash their loot afterwards? Scummiest thing to do.

  • I suggest just talking to a DM about this, there's enough negativity on the forum as is.

  • maybe people should go back to ooc asking what people are comfortable with in terms of pvp in tells or what have you before initiating, etc.

    None of the pvp I've gotten into in v5 has this happened; and I have not been 'looking' for pvp, or developing much with real 'pvp plot' with any of the pc's who pvp'd me.

    That said, generally the pvp I've been in in v5 has been handled well, at least in recent memory;
    what bothered me more was the sort of metagaming in going on quests/ doing quests in such as way as to have other party members (me) likely to be killed /seriously injured during the quests, which happened a number of times to me. Sort of like a 'softening up' for eventual pvp? Keep other players lower level, and get them killed when they do quest with you (and every/any body else on the server?)

    Maybe it wasn't even conscious at the time, who knows.

    But obviously, some people are taking some of the pvp personally; so maybe you should be asking before you put people in the situations you have been.

    I've been told, and criticised and insulted, that if i 'can't' handle pvp, than i better not get involved in stuff, etc, and that it's a pvp server, so if I'm going through old town or whatever, and someone decides to pvp me, full damage, full loot, or whatever, that is MY problem, deal.

    Which is why I have a tracker who can use stealth. Who can make the basic weapons I would need to start questing again, etc.

    So while on the one hand, focussing on pvp is not my preference, I was fully willing to dump lots of important items that I found fun for roleplaying to get enough underweight to be able to move normally, when the whole server was going on gank squads for killing any elves on the server (supposedly npc elves in the hullack, but there were a number of pc elves etc in this roleplaying situation, a number of whom got involved in serious pvp stuff… i seem to remember 'scalping' was a part of it, from both sides...)

    Where do you get off forcing me to play the game your way, and all the time and effort i've put in to developing my character, who maybe has never even interacted with yours before, just to become a footnote in YOUR pc's plotz?

    Conflict is the name of the game on the server apparently, ok, fine. But people are putting time and energy into these stories, which are being trampled on,and tl;dr as people reach the heights of glory and server reknown with their 'somebody's' (high level means you're a somebody, right?).

    I'm making alts to support other people's stories, with whom I'm much happier being a 'tragedy' in order to move forward someone else story. If you do that with my main pc, without history, interaction, knowing or caring about my plot, and just pwn me and tell me to 'start over again yer ded' , its going to get frustrating after awhile, for even the most hardcore gamer.

    Should you not pvp?
    Should you walk on egg-shells when there is conflict?
    Maybe not, but talking to people about the pvp, what you are looking for, etc, may help keeping
    'create ig conflict'
    from becoming/conflating with
    'creating personal/ooc conflict'.

    my 2cents.

    and just for the record, i know people are just trying to have fun, and it is not personal, and it is probably just, in some ways, a difference of playstyles, and a lack of realizing other people's perspectives, but I think this needs to be said, so there it is.

  • I think one of the biggest problems I see with PvP myself is people INITIATING conflict or PvP with other PCs and then when they lose reacting negatively to it. Something that is just as bad as a poor winner is a poor loser and with the nature of conflict on CoA, there is BOUND to be PvP happening. If you don't feel that you can handle PvP and/or don't want to be involved in PvP in any way, then that is fine. However, making a die hard LG paladin is not the way to avoid PvP. Or a very insane CE criminal. I always try and be as friendly as I can with PvP and always take into consideration that not every one enjoys PvP. In my mind, a bad loser has just as much of the "Win/loss" mentality as a bad winner. What is important is that PvP is often a stepping stone which is used to develop more conflict and push the story of all PC's involved further.

    Scenario A where Good guy steals the evil plot item of Bad guy so he is always trying to capture him and lots of PvP ensues. If people would stop being so focused on "OMG I LOST" or "YES I WON, LOOT", as opposed to continuing to play their character and maintaining a high level of roleplay, there would be far less complaints about PvP. In fact, I have not once ever been bitter about losing any PvP in CoA. I love PvP and every aspect of it, I think most of the players here know that. I like winning, I like losing. I like being ganked. Strange right? The idea of PvP is exciting to me and FUN. I love pursuing intense drama filled conflict with other players.

    If you don't want to PvP ever, that is totally fine. However, to avoid that best, you should play a very dull PC who is extremely neutral, which generally isn't that fun.

    People mold PC's around things they think would be cool or exciting to play, they come up with an awesome concept and want to breathe life into it. These PC's are born with goals and ideals. The bloodthirsty half-orc is BOUND to want to start fights with elves JUST because you're an elf.

    There will always be conflict on CoA as it is what makes the game exciting. Being able to roll with the conflict no matter what happens is really what stands out to me as a quality of a mature player and a great one.

    Sorry for the rant but I am normally kind of reserved when it comes to this stuff and it is something that should be addressed.

  • I agree with King-Dobby on this, the only thing that makes me reluctant to pvp is that people seem far too aggresive with looting.

  • The best part about PvP is always getting that item in 5 minutes of sudden PvP that some other player and his friends invested days if not weeks of effort to obtain. Tried and true, and not at all discouraged by DMs. Its one of those things that tell me that mechanical power is more important on this server.

    Why work with your friends to earn your own item, when you can just take it from someone else? Especially if you're good at it.

  • @Thune:

    Why work with your friends to earn your own item, when you can just take it from someone else? Especially if you're good at it.

    Because those days or weeks are part of the story–-Or was that a rhetorical question;-)?

  • I think the player was probably pissed off at after going along with all the aftermath of the pvp including being used as a blood sacrifice to have a player randomly decide to loot him of the DM loot he spent his game time earning as an after thought.
    And who among us wouldn't want to have all there efforts taken away by such an awesome event not a one!

    Oh and thanks Thune you made me smile.

  • Storyteller [DM]

    I don't think that sounded ranty at all, Dobby. I think it sounded spot on.

    *Edit - I do however disagree that if you play a character that avoids pvp you are necessarily playing a boring character. I can think of lots of ways to make you character interesting and avoid getting your ass handed to you. You probably just won't be a badass, which is fine. A complete coward could be a very fun and interesting character.

  • Storyteller [DM]

    Also, Wraith - If you think you have fallen victim to excessive looting you can contact a DM. People should not be stripping their victims and leaving them penniless.

    Take their sword and taunt them to try and get it back, or take their gold, or drain that massive sack of potions, but show some courtesy. Otherwise you may find your encounter ret-conned.

    My own experience with (A lot of) PvP is that most people are actually pretty good about this.

  • The entire point of taking faction loot or a certain item is that it is likely in some way special. This will probably drive the PC who lost the loot to create a plan to get it back.

    Does it take away from the story that led you to earning the item, or the story to come? No. In fact, thinking that your PC is worth ending because you lost some loot is just as win/loss focused as all the rest of it. Comments like that Thune really just disappoint me.

  • In my opinion, faction loot is given mostly to people who proved their worth through their IC actions. To have that taken away because they aren't as powerful mechanically does kinda turn it all to ashes in your mouth. This is coming from someone who has gotten faction gear as a reward on 2 PC's since v5 and had both taken away within 2 days of earning it. I try to think that the gear will help balance out some of the gaps in PvP skill, but that's just my opinion. There are other ways to get people to build conflict. Gear theft should be the last way to drive someone to get it back. If you really want to steal some loot and try to get people to push for it back, steal plot loot. If there is no plot loot going around, then find a different way to push conflict.

  • If there is a problem with looting let me know when I'm IG with a dm? Or have someone message me? I can return some of the stuff! I've most of the select gear on my character and would return it readily! From the one who got looted on the stars side. (I was not the one who took it, I just ended up with a good deal of it, I'd rather not be involved in the mess of he said she said, who did what)

  • Just to clarify we weren't a gank squad we were out pushing a plot.

    Your group's in game actions meant i had to react to it and pvp took place and i was happy with what happened. I even enjoyed the event all the way through there was conflict being crated between the groups and it was a good first encounter. But then after the event finished you decided to take my character's faction gear as an after thought which spoiled the event for me and turned me off conflict with you.

  • I can completely understand that. I have been put in that position and seen others placed in it. A quick tell to the player can help alleviate much of the angst that comes into play when that is happening. Dobby is a much more aggressive player than I am, but I don't think he is unreasonable. Also. DMs. we have Dungeon Masters to keep the survivor on track as best they can. I felt terrible after the event. listening to a character, who I had personally grown attached to and try to help prosper, suddenly up and die, kinda sucks. For both players, not just the dead one. I had like, bad ooc feelings. "shit, we just ruined CoA for this guy" that kinda stuff. speak your piece! be heard! call on the DMs!

  • My issue is that there are bunch of alternative punishments to straight up killing a guy over 'oh no my armor has been taken', but most of the time someone will kill a guy rather than:

    Pit them, Stock them, Put them on trial, Throw them in the penal legion, Take something of theirs, Take an ally of their's to blackmail them with, Blackmail them in general, Beat up said person and only take the item back with a few items as well which perhaps would lead to a constant tug of war that lasts a good while, petty verbal insults that provoke both sides, erotica read over the sending system about two people said person wants to irk, etc etc etc.

    Honestly I've see way more people on the so called "Evil side" be courteous in this regard than the "Good Guys" (This is subjective to view of course), and all it does is discourage me from letting people walk away from pvp 'they' started typically.

    If all you can think of when it comes to facilitating extended conflict is "They hit me once lightly, now I'll kill them and take everything on their person so they can't do anything to me ever again", I can't help but feel like you're not doing much for the server.

  • erotica read over the sending system about two people said person wants to irk, etc etc etc.

    That will always remain one of the greatest moments of V5 for me.

  • How I play taking faction loot is giving them an easy option to get it back.

    Stole an advisor cloak and tried to sell it back to him for a sausage. That's good fun. He can have it back no problem, there's no real hard feelings.
    I of course didn't get a sausage. I instead got two bottles of ale out of it. Boom, big success, many funs, will steal something important again and hold it hostage for sausage.
    It gives you all the IC perks of a that faction being pissed his stuff was stolen, and there's no bad feelings.

  • Again, gotta give Props to Regle–--
    Live the adventure 🙂
    As far as I know, hes returned everything hes ever nicked from any of my characters. hes not taking things t keep them,

    he might as well be wearing a sandwich board that says HI, I'M GOING TO ROB YOU NOW AND YOU WON'T EVEN KNOW IT on the front for all to see, and on the backSEE, I TOLD YA!

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