Game Etiquette would help a ton
I am writing this asking for some perspective and feedback from the community here, as a veteran gamer since 1981 but the new guy on the server. Yes, i am ancient.. now that thats over with.. the topic.
No where, in anything i have ever been present in, as far as loot goes, compares to the incredible chaos of trying to divy up 10 items in this world.
Here are some suggestions/ observations to make that go smoother…
1. Everyone but the leader or designated loot person should shut the hell up.
AT THE MOMENT OF LOOT DISTRIBUTION: We dont care what specific piece you want or think you have a right to claim offhand, for whatever reason .... we dont care how badly that +1 butterknife of doom has been sought after by your character since you were 3 and had yours taken by your little sister, we dont care how much you spent on crap to take care of others, we dont want to have you carry on sub plot discussions about the great and powerful Plutarg, Death Demon Knight from the Abyss and how he has your Sister's cousin on your mothers side 4th removed held captive in his right front shirt pocket dimmension. ALL WE WANT TO DO IS GET THE LOOT DISTRIBUTED FAIRLY WITHOUT A MIGRAINE FORMING.
I know this is a horrible sin, to break character, from your well thought out, so deep and enriching pain in every single persons backside character that you spent years developing, but deal with it. The job of a leader is hectic. They deserve a measure of order.. after a long a drawn out fight.. to just relax and get things settled with loot. Not fight 20 morons for chat lines, while they are trying to relay important info and get on with thier fun too. Have some respect for the players themselves.
2. Random.. If you do infact decide to do a random roll, Snog's player made a great suggestion once.. everyone observe a period of silence... when its clear everyone has stopped typing.. everyone roll. That clears the chat lines, and lets you easily see who rolled what.. then just get in line based on that order. Its not tough.
3. In no way am i discouraging roleplaying.. by all means, complain, whine, whatever, before, and after loot is done... just not during. Too many people , DESERVING people, walk away from loot distro, not because the character would, but because the player doesnt want the headache. Its just not fun.
I welcome all input and ideas from the community, these opinions are mine, from years of being a raid leader in MMOs, and the experience that comes with that.
Mr.Moloch last edited by
Just play your character. There will be no OOC rules on how to handle loot.
That said, there's no need to be an IC pain in the butt.
I expect this thread will be locked quickly though if people go off topic or get nasty.
I think that should be sorted IC. Who's most "deserving" is a matter of perspective, both IC and OOC. The only real guideline is not to run off with a bunch of DM loot, even if your character has sticky fingers normally. Everything beyond that is up to the characters.
I get your point on the OOC aggravation of loot distribution, I really do. As a DM, I've had the pleasure of avoiding loot distribution for three years. I participated in one for the first time last week, and it took almost as long as the DM quest before it. It was excruciating, but it was IC. If a group of players individually has a better way of doing it, than I say go for it.
However, I should say finally that it look like all you want to do is get the loot distributed evenly without a migraine forming, not fairly. Your text abive indicates that you don't care about fairness, just equality of opportunity. It also implies that you don't care about any IC considerations- just the OOC consideration of making sure that every player involved gets the chance to loot their character evenly, regardless of plot considerations, cost, motivation, or anything else.
I witnessed the event aftermath that likely motivated you to start this thread. While I can understand your frustration, that's just how things go. There are a great many characters out there that are selfish, oafish, and a pain in the ass. What you encountered might be the norm for those characters regardless of any OOC consideration the players make.
Take it as an IC event that will forever mold your concept and make her think twice about trying to take charge of a chaotic rabble of adventurers, in any situation. That aftermath already has had IC ramifications for my current character and will effect how he reacts in future IG matters.
Frankly I've always been of the opinion that those that can use an item should be entitled to it. If more than one person can use said item, then they should roll for it. Then whatever's left can be up for grabs.
Whenever we as a group have done this, it's always fast, and doesn't leave people too upset. It won't be fair, but it's not because of the distribution, it's because of the findings. Sometimes you just don't find things useful to your character.
But I never cared for people rolling for turns. It ends up with people taking things they barely need, just because its their turn, whereas another character just lost their chance to get something they'd really like.
First, thanks for the feedback. Much like finding a new gaming group IRL, which i am sure some of you have experienced, you have to feel out how they new folks play, and if your style of play and enjoyment is a good match.
To clarify, i wasnt trying to enforce a completely equal split.. i said fair. Fair may very well mean the fighter who carried the whole raid, gets the lion's share of the spoils.. What i meant by the shutting up comment, and the we dont care comments.. is the physical act of typing them out on the screen while the act itself, of loot divying, was occuring. In no way was i trying to stiffle anyone's valid points in loot rights.'
We have to deal with a mechanic.. the chat window.. that while IC< would be easy to hear one person talking over 20 people adjusting thier cloaks and sitting down, etc.. but the restrictions of the interface, make it so that one sentence is scrolled up into oblivion. That was my point on that. Not stopping valid rp from occuring, no matter how disruptive.
Another way to look at it.. if you were running a game, in your house, and 4 players constantly talked over your designated party leader throughout the entire module… while you were running the game, what would you do as a DM?
This was purely from a game mechanics/ limitation of the chat window perspective, sorry if i was unclear.
Usually, I get my coins and leave. I, the player, don't have the patience for arguing over the loot. I created an excuse for my character, however. He tells himself the adventure's the reward. He, and I, can get by without owning the +1 Butter Knife of Doom anyway.
My comment regarding game etiquette is players shouldn't be afraid to let their characters become the supporting character of another character's story from time to time instead of the star of their own story all of the time. You won't dwindle into obscurity if you let another character have their moment in the spotlight. I'm guilty of this too. I'm trying harder to shut up when other characters have the stage, however. I feel like it's all about give and take.
Frankly I've always been of the opinion that those that can use an item should be entitled to it.
I 2nd this.
EX: You are on a quest, and their is a sword, potions and a magic staff(Wizard and sorc only) on the ground. Your group consists of 2 fighters, A wizard and a barbarian. Why should the fighters or the barbarians need the magic staff when they cant even use it and would just sell it for gold.
Greed before Need, except to facilitate Speed.
Speed is when you have more than 8 PCs. I'm talking 20 or 30 like some DM events. You'll be insane to try anything else.
I have played games forever also. I have not always played Role Playing, or hardcore Role Playing, with that said it is not the same for me to handle loot situation in Arabel. I do it from the characters point of view no matter how annoying or unfair it gets. I just make my chat window huge since I wont be fighting or moving when they are discussing about the loot.
I have watched evil characters grab all the good loot in a group and I have walked away with just the coins and see it as fun. I just do a few smart emotes like, "he grabs the coins and count his blessings considering the crowd he is in" and walk away. I have also chased some character in town wielding a greataxe to have my loot because I thought "need before greed" was unfair, all in character, and with greedy clearly stated in my characters description. Today I just cut in line because I could not wait for my turn to get the coins. All while risking being hated by everyone, people deciding I should not get coins because they get annoy with me, but the thing is I was having fun. I didn't think that in any of the above situations, even when I was the victim, that I was hurting anyone. I think is fun for everyone.
I am a big supporter of loot being handle in game through roleplaying in Arabel. For better or worst, and some characters never shut up, never listen, never stop getting the whole group in trouble, never do anything big to help anyone, never, never, never but as long as you roleplay I see it as the best thing possible for Arabel.
I stay ic when it comes to loot.
If my character is in charge of the group then i tend to pass out things like potions gold and a few items depending on what others did ie staying ic adding to the fun or taking risks but thats me when there is more than one person that would want an item i either give it to somone or just drop it on the floor and tell them to sort it out between them.
But this is done In Character and i feel it should stay that way.
Never had any issue with loot distribution. it all boils down to how you made your char, how greedy he/she is and does he/she leadership qualities. Make it IC with IC repercussions. Dont think there is any OOC etiquette needed
In all honesty, when you first start playing here, loot feels special. It is a server designed to be low level loot, so when something comes around thats nice it makes sense to want it. However, after time, you begin to realize that nice loot, while still something everyone wants, comes and goes like the wind, and really has nothing to do with how much fun you have with the server. I have had characters that have had insane loot, but bored me from an RP standpoint, and characters that have had a janky banded mail that I have had a blast with. So, as has been said, keeping it ic is just an extention of whats important to the server.
And, yes, there have been times I have been frustrated with loot distribution. Sometimes you are just stuck with a bunch of greedy people, ic or ooc, and things get silly. I tend to just walk away in these instances, since loot does not define how I have fun with the game, and I'm not going to let other people drag me into the mud over a +1 sword. The amount of nice loot on the server is defined by the dms alone, and taking the high road in a sticky situation eventually gets noticed, even if it doesnt happen every time you do it. Beyond that even, it always makes me feel good when I know I passed up something beneficial to my character for the benefit of the server by not being thrown into a pissing contest over who deserves what.
O-louth last edited by
I hate the rolls. I really really really do.
Hence, i go by the "I am the leader, so shut up while i talk" approach.
In short, I look around, and decide:
This +1 +4 fire dam flail. Hmm, didnt the frontliner Bob use such a thing? "Bob, want this?"
And if people complain, fuck them.
In general, those who get greedy are the ones who didnt do much anyhow.
caek last edited by
When I was DMing I used to heap the loot onto one person in the group for them to distribute.
Just remember at the end of the day it's a computer game and don't be a dick about it. Chill and be a mellow sausage.
"I am the leader, so shut up while i talk"
I realize this is where I'm making things derail off-topic, so I apologize for that. But I'd have a hard time justifying the above without invoking a DM. As players, we have to accept to listen to DMs when they say the above. That means they decide whose quests get the loot in the first place; the people with IC power are usually the ones to "take" leadership even if there were 4 people with 4 different goals there, but the "leader" is empowered in his position (as if it was IC true for all characters present that he is seen as elader) by the OOC factor of DMs not wanting that loot to be stolen from under people.
I'm not saying it's bad, or shouldn't be; just saying it has its flaws despite being the most efficient way to look at leadership from an IC point of view. By that token, if we were to remain IC, there would be fights at nearly every distribution after a big event. I've been on 4+ events in the last few days that had a ton of players in the party; only Slavarian's event has a clear IC leader that half the characters didn't want to slap their mouth shut and were only staying docile in distribution for OOC reasons.
So, while having one person distribute is most efficient, it's by no means IC in all its aspects; no matter the IC authority invoked (which comes down to invoking the threat of the manpower they command; why would the min-maxed orc who manages to kill the "leader" not be entitled by the same rule?) it's ultimately not.
I disagree that DM's define who the leader is. Yes, they may have given quest A to player B, but I think you would be hard pressed to find a DM that doesn't like a bit of discord and chaos amongst the party rp wise along the way.
Another thing, if its IC to argue over loot, then do it, don't be docile for OOC reasons. However, don't be an ass to the point that people no longer want to be around you from an ooc perspective. Think of it along the same lines of OOC curtesy when it comes to PvP. Its alright to be an ulikable Jackass, just remember its a game that people play to have fun.
Everybody has fun in his or her own way.
Being OOC kind and patient around a big box of loot isn't one of them. Its influenced alot by RP before during and occasionally after the trash has been divvied out.
The way games have been made the last few years your always just going from one thing to a slightly better thing that looks exactly the same. It makes players more materialistic in my point of view. As well as less patient and what not.
Assuming I have the time I can stand there all day just to get my +1 butterknife of doom. Or my cure serious wounds potion, because I know I earned somthing IC and OOC.
There are always going to be some people who feel like they have been getting shorted on loot for whatever reason. Everyone has felt it at one time or another, but there is never enough to go around for a unruly mob recklessly throwing themselves at DM spice.
You get your gold and your equipment from questing and shops, if you get something from a DM event, first be thankful you could participate. Second be thankful if you walk away with something you couldn't normally have.
Thats my fifty cents.
Camazotz last edited by
be a mellow sausage.